An online forum on Educating Service Children run by the House of Commons Defence Committee

Service Families

We would like to hear your views on the quality of the education provided in Service schools abroad. The schools we saw in Germany were very good: is this true for all schools, for all ages? How about services for older children?

We have heard that Service families can experience problems when moving back to the UK, or to another place in the UK. In particular, we have heard that there can be problems in getting a school place if you do not have an address.

What has been your experience with Service Children’s Education schools abroad? How do you think they could be improved?
What has been your experience of moving schools, when transferring to and within the UK? How could this be improved?
We would also like to know of any other issues you think we should address. For example, what are the issues facing those who want to use boarding schools in the UK? Is the Boarding School Allowance adequate?

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This forum is now closed

Posted by Ross on 26/05/2006 - 15:52

Hello.

This consultation forum is now closed. Posting is no longer possible. The forum will remain open so that you can read the posts that were made between April 18 – May 26 2006.

To see the Defence Committee’s closing statement please visit the forum’s homepage.

Thank you.

Ross
Hansard Society, Moderation Team

Transferring schools

Posted by Juliette Bellingall on 26/05/2006 - 05:50

After 4 years in Germany my husband was posted back to the UK and we were allocated a quarter in West Byfleet, Surrey. I applied for places in the schools I wanted the children to go to. Having taught in the area before I was married I had some local knowledge.
I found:
1. All the popular schools with good SATS results, Ofsted reports or good Value Added scores were full or could not offer me places for all of my 3 children.
2. All 3 children were offered a place in an undesirable school.
3. Because my youngest child was in Key Stage 2, where class sizes have a strict limit of 30, there was no flexibility to offer me a place.
4. I applied from Germany, so a place would not be held for me because I did not live in the area and I did not have an address.
5. I had to start the appeal process in my chosen school to gain a place.

Boarding School

Posted by Juliette Bellingall on 26/05/2006 - 05:33

The eldest of my 3 children decided he wanted to go to boarding school when faced with the prospect of starting his sixth school at the age of 9.

We found a school with good pastoral care and where boarding is central to the ethos of the school. I feel this is necessary to make the boarding school experience a positive one for the family. I have heard too many horror stories of service children unhappy because they are not kept busy enough at the weekends or there are not enough boarders in at the weekend. One friend's child ran away from school when she was living in Germany because he was so unhappy.

Closing comments

Posted by Committee Member on 24/05/2006 - 12:58

Service children should receive the same standard of education as any other child. Some of the difficulties that are experienced by teachers, families and young people themselves have been clearly brought home to me and my colleagues on the Defence Committee over the last few weeks.

As we begin the last few days of the forum, I would like to ask teachers: what single improvement could the MoD/DfES easily introduce to improve the education of Service children?

Mike Hancock MP

Secondary Education in Germany

Posted by Andy Liggat on 21/05/2006 - 13:39

After 21 years of service, I am currently serving with NATO at Ramstein in southwest Germany, and am accompanied by my wife and two daughters, aged 13 and 11. To date, both girls have attended excellent UK LEA schools and have, therefore, been brought up and educated in a family environment. This is, I believe, a fundamental component of my children’s education and social development. Although they are both on their 5th school, they have adapted well to the nomadic lifestyle with no apparent degradation to their educational performance or social well-being. Consequently, I was somewhat concerned to find out that the only secondary education options on offer from Ramstein were either UK boarding school or to send children to Rheindahlen where they board 3 weeks at a time. The local German secondary schools will not accept non german speaking pupils. For the reasons stated above, I was not willing to send my daughters to UK boarding school nor was Rheindahlen an attractive option as it too necessitated boarding and also the experiences of others at Ramstein had called into question its pastoral care. I therefore decided on home education via a UK based Internet school (InterHigh) - a choice that others at Ramstein have subsequently followed. SCE have repeatedly stated that they will not fund internet-based home education and consequently, I am having to pay for my daughters’ education entirely out of my own pocket. I find it hard to accept that in this day and age, in Central Europe, working in a major NATO headquarters that my job is deemed, on grounds of childrens’ education, not to be compatible with a family based unit. My Support Unit is currently looking into the possibility of making available secondary education at the local DoD American High School at public expense.

Secondary Education in Germany

Posted by J Johnson on 16/05/2006 - 21:02

After 16 years of service, I am now on my 7th posting, second overseas. I have 3 children aged 13, 11 and 8 and the eldest is on her 6th school. She has always adapted well and we have focussed on the benefits of different experiences as opposed to the lose of continuity of both education and friends. However, now that the children are moving to secondary education and we are overseas, it appears the tide has changed and I fear that my children are now disadvantaged as ‘service children’. I consider myself as an active parent and have been a parent governor at several previous schools. My previous posting was for 12 mths and to Aug 05 my children were at excellent UK LEA schools. I am now serving with NATO at Ramstein in southwest Germany (not a choice posting) and, as a parent that enjoys taking an active part in my children’s education, I am not prepared to send my children off to UK boarding school. From Ramstein the options are UK boarding school or to send children to Rheindahlen where they board 3 weeks at a time. Local German secondary schools will not accept non german speaking pupils. While I have no specific qualms about the standard of education at Rheindahlen, their pastoral care is inadequate: there is no continuity of care and, combined with a lack of funds and enthusiasm, this allows a culture of bullying and anti-social behaviour to develop. I engaged with the school regarding my concerns but nothing was done and eventually I removed my daughter. She is now educated at home over the internet at my expense. It appears that this is not an isolated case and that several others at Ramstein have expressed concern regarding the school and have chosen other options for secondary education (internet, UK boarding, or local German School). SCE have repeatedly stated that they will not fund internet-based home education and my daughter’s German is not strong enough for her to be educated in a foreign language. I am now working with my Support Unit to prepare a case for my 2 eldest children to have their secondary education at the local DoD American High School at public expense. (copies of correspondence can be emailed to the Committee if necessary)
To clarify, my key points are:
- Internet-based schooling should be a recognised and supported option.
- SCE Schools with a residential facility need to be funded and staffed better, they need to be more like boarding schools (ie facilities available) and less like a school with an accommodation block attached.
- Unless children are bi-lingual, secondary education in a foreign language is an non-starter.

UK Schooling

Posted by irzb on 14/05/2006 - 15:35

The problems facing children in the UK schools does not only affect those returning to the UK from an overseas posting. The same applies to all service children whose parent is posted after the normal cut off date for school entry.
The MOD needs to work alongside the Ministry for Education to ensure that all Service Children have the same rights as every other child.
Parental choice has made a situation where children with stable lives are able to attend the best schools, leaving more 'mobile' children with no choice of school - and more often than not, the school that no other parent wants for their child.
We have already experienced problems obtaining nursery places for our children when posted in the Spring or Summer Terms, as nursery places, like school places, are usually filled in the September.
A recent posting to Marlow left us having to go to appeal in order to get our daughter into a school that was less than 100yds from our house. During the appeal process, we discovered that over half the school children attending that school were coming from outside the catchment area because it was deemed to be a better school than the one on the other side of town. The latter school, however, was considered perfectly acceptable for all the Service children arriving in the area!
So what could be done to improve this situation?
1) Postings need to be decided at least a year in advance to allow families to plan their children's education.
2) The DE must work alongside the posting desks to ensure that addresses can be provided to the families in order for school applications to be made.
3) Perhaps Bett's suggestion of a more stable family life for Service men and women could be considered.
4) If none of the above can be achieved, then perhaps the Government should fund school and nursery places for all Service children, not just those wishing to opt for boarding schools. Headteachers are unable to keep places available for children moving into the area because of the funding regulations. If the money went with the child, in the same way that the Health Service is offering Health Care in a hospital of the patient's choice, then Service children could opt for the school of their choice - be it state or private.

Posting to Northern Ireland - July/August birthdays

Posted by mcallisters on 12/05/2006 - 10:48

When posted into Northern Ireland, parents need to be aware that 1st July is the last date in the academic year, and therefore the cut off date for admission into year groups. Service children with birthdays in July/August are often then put into a year below that which they would be in on the mainland. With the frequent moves that disrupt education in the first place, this then causes another lack of continuity in education. This is being looked at by the Northern Ireland Department of Education, and schools who frequently accept service children will look at keeping children in their correct year group. Those already in first year primary and first year in secondary school have a place honoured. Sadly the disruption is for those outside of these years.

UK Schooling - returning from overseas

Posted by jaet on 12/05/2006 - 10:02

1. We are about to return to the UK from an overseas posting.
2. In the area where we have been 'penciled in' for a quarter there is only one school in the catchment area.
3. Needless to say, it is oversubscribed and has 7 children already on the waiting list.
4. According to the LEA the only schools available with a place are a car journey away and ones that sit a long way down in the league tables (although I agree that League Tables aren't everything).
5. There is no funding available to go and view schools before hand, so we have applied to the closest ones to where we think we will be living which may or may not be suitable for my child.
6. We asked the housing officer for a letter to send with our school application to say that we would be moving into the area. However, at the moment we cannot officially be allocated a quarter and when we are in the time frame, it will be the very end of term and going in to the summer holidays.
7. The schools are sympathetic but say they can do nothing with my application until we actually have a quarter allocated.

schooling within UK

Posted by fionalyon on 11/05/2006 - 21:30

I have just entered into the school experience and have been disappointed that service families are treated less favourably because of their particular circumstances which not of their own making. There is little you can do when faced with a lack of address even if you are able to have some idea of a new posting. This means that you are often a late applicant and therefore have to get what everyone else chooses not to take up. When you have little choice as to where you live in service accomodation, it seems strange that you then have to travel,often by car as a local school place is not available.